Glenn McQueenie & Dean Jackson – Your Skills are Your Security Part 2 of 2

Please check out Dean Jackson’s awesome new Podcast at

“20 Minutes of Successful Niche Secrets – EPISODE 43,”

With Dean Jackson where we talk about the value of the Long Game and Lead Conversion (Part 2 of 2)

Glenn: Hi! It’s Glenn McQueenie, and welcome to my 25-Minute Success Series podcast. Today we’re just going to go into part two of a great conversation that I had on my last podcast with Dean Jackson. Dean Jackson’s been a really incredible coach and mentor to me in my life over the last 20 years, and in part two, we’re going to be talking about the value of your old leads compared to your new leads. In the first one, we were talking about the return on the investment of your lead generation, and really focusing more on slowing down your lead conversion in order to actually speed up and convert more leads. We talked a bit about how with Zillow’s numbers, basically they were getting 1.4 closed transactions for every 100 leads that they sent to their realtors, and we had this discussion about those numbers maybe not being exactly correct. All of the equity in your business is just in the follow-up of your lead, so when they sent those short bursts of leads and only got 1.4 out of 100, I think Dean Jackson was suggesting that it actually should be around 40%, 50%, or 60%, if you’re willing to spend the time and convert those leads. I think Internet lead generation is really about, first of all, just funnelling your leads. Some people are hot leads, and they have to buy in the next 90 days. That’s about 15% of the population. Then you’ve got your second bucket, which is warm leads, and they’re probably going to be more like the 3-9 month zone. And then you’ve got your cooler leads, who are just starting the process, and they’re going to be people who will probably buy in 9-18 months. And I think what you’ll see in this conversation in part two is how the value and the equity in your business is really in the later leads – in your warm and your cool leads; not in your hot leads right now. So I really encourage you to listen to this, and also, really make 2018 the year that you focus on the long-term, and building long-term equity in your business, not just the short-term leads that you get every day. The problem with them is, if only 15% of them are going to do something, it’s really hard to build a long-term business with such a low number. So, here it is – part two with Dean Jackson:

Glenn: I really wanted to just talk about the whole idea of slowing down your lead conversion in order to speed up your lead conversion, so what can you say about that? I think a lot of people are like, “If I don’t close them right away, that’s it. Move on. Next, next, next.”

Dean: Yeah.

Glenn: Where I think it’s really about breaking it down to each little step and just going deep, and coming from contribution and helping them.


Glenn: And then you’ll lead them to their next logical step.

Dean: That’s a great way of saying it – slowing down to speed up. Here’s the thing. In order for you to actually do business with somebody, they are what I call a five-star prospect. That means that they are willing to engage in the dialogue, they’re friendly and cooperative, they know what they want, they know when they want it, and they’d like us to help them. That’s a five-star prospect. They have to meet all five of those criteria in order to start working with them. All five of them have to be there. Otherwise, you’re not going to. Which one would you give up? If they don’t want to work with you, that’s one thing. The reality is that here’s the thing: there’s nothing you can do to create a five-star prospect. You can only discover a five-star prospect. When somebody raises their hand, they either are or are not a five-star prospect right now. So the only thing I focus on is starting at the top, with number one: are they willing to engage in the dialogue? What most people do is they get a lead, and they start hammering them on why now is the right time to buy, and “Let’s set up an appointment,” and “Let me come on over, or come on into the office. Rates are going up. Prices are going up. We don’t know what’s going to happen. We need to really get you to move right now,” right? All of that stuff to close people, convert people. They’re using convert as a verb. They’re doing something to convert these people. What I look at is the actual way that people want to experience this. If they are a five-star prospect, if we just send a quick email to them and engage in the dialogue with them, they’ll respond. And if they respond back and forth, then you’re now engaged in a friendly and cooperative dialogue, where they can tell you what they want, and you can find out when they want it, and then set a prescription for what the next step would be. If they don’t respond initially, then move people into your long-term follow-up program, where you are educating and motivating them about the market, giving them updates on what’s going on, and giving them the opportunity, whenever they’re ready, to take the next step (which may be to come to your homebuyer workshop, or it may be to come on a tour of homes, or it may be to get a free home loan report). Whatever your options are for people to raise their hand, you’re just presenting it to them that way.

Glenn: I think that’s such a great point, because it’s really about a dance, right?


Glenn: It’s like a slow dance with them, and dancing how they want to be danced with, in a way.

Dean: Right.

Glenn: Instead of leading by closing – “Oh, we’ve got to close, close, close!” – it’s like, “How about we just engage in a conversation?” because the conversation really is the relationship between us. How I show up, and how I come from, “What can I give?” instead of “What can I take from you?” (or convert – I love how you used that) is really the essence, I think, of lead generation. It’s leading them through contribution; not closing them because of your selfish need to get a deal in the next week or five days, because the market doesn’t care about that.

Dean: That’s exactly right. You’re absolutely right.

Glenn: Right. What else would you say in our last minute here, Dean, on conversion? So they’ve got to be willing to engage in conversation.

Dean: Well, here’s the thing. Here are the two biggest opportunities that I see right now. Number one is, you’ve probably got a selection of leads that didn’t convert back months ago, and you’ve given up on them, because you were in that mode of, “If they’re not going to buy in 30 days, they’re fired.” Well let’s go back to those people, and just send a quick, nine-word email and say, “Hey Glenn, are you still looking for a house in Georgetown?” and find out what happened. See if you can re-engage with some of those people. I think the other big opportunity, Glenn, is to quietly (don’t tell anybody that you listened to this podcast), go look around in your world and listen for people who are griping about Zillow leads, or griping about, “These leads are no good,” and then maybe offer to buy people’s old leads. That’s a real great opportunity. I think that even just to start re-engaging with those people, and to start giving some valuable insight to them would be a really great thing.

Glenn: That’d be so cool. “I know you paid the retail price for those leads, but it didn’t look like it worked out so well for you, so how about we pay you 20% of what you paid for that lead?”

“Give me a hundred of your leads. I’ll buy them. I’ll give you $500, and let’s see.” I guarantee you there are deals in there. That’s the thing.

Glenn: Absolutely. And I think in a lot of the research that I’ve done at EKOS – (and also, I’ve been a big fan of yours for many years) – but the sweet spot is probably that 9-15 month lead.

Dean: Yeah.

Glenn: It really seems to be that that’s the person who’s probably most likely to actually do something in the next 90 days. It’s not the person who just contacted you.

Right. That’s exactly right.

Glenn: Dean, thank you so much.

Dean: I love it!

Glenn: Always a pleasure. You’re a big deal, and just for those listening, if you want to know more about Dean, he’s got a bunch of really great podcasts. One of my favourites is “The Joy of Procrastination” with Dan Sullivan.

Dean: Yeah!

Glenn: I just love listening to you guys on that one, and also “More Cheese Less Whiskers.” And now you’ve got the “Listing Agent Lifestyle.” Is that what you said?

Dean: Yeah. “Listing Agent Lifestyle.” I’m super excited about that one, because that’s a whole philosophy, and yeah – you’ll really love it.

Glenn: Wow. So you’ve taken the “Thug Life” concept and brought it to “Listing Agent Lifestyle.”

Dean: That’s right!

Glenn: Alright Dean, thank you so much!

Dean: Thank you.

Glenn: It’s always a pleasure to chat with you. Just stay on for a second, Dean, okay?

Dean: Okay, yeah.

Glenn: Bye.

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